How to Confirm Property Taxes via County Tax Assessor

Caeli Ridge recorded this episode on 11/28/2023
 
Have you ever been hit with a property tax bill that far exceeded your expectations? You've come to the right place ! Caeli breaks down property tax definitions for us as well as showing us how you can know exactly what you'll be paying in property taxes based on the county in which your property resides.

We dive into a Q & A after this explanation as well as some news, updates and expectations for rates and other real estate investment pieces.

Check out the video with the screen share and the documentation in the Community and our YouTube Channel.

https://www.youtube.com/c/RidgeLendingGroup

You can join these live  by following this link to join the call:
https://community.ridgelendinggroup.com/events/live-with-caeli

As always, give Ridge Lending Group a call if you have any questions at 
855-747-4343 or email us at info@RidgeLendingGroup.com

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Transcript

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Karlie Libby: All right. Hello, and welcome everyone to calling all real estate investors. This is a twice-monthly show live show with Caeli Ridge from Ridge lending group we meet the first and third Tuesdays of the month generally, but keep an eye out in the

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Karlie Libby: emails that we send out for any updates. But

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Karlie Libby: you can always reach us at by calling 85574743430r you can email us at info at Ridgelendending group.com with any questions. And if you have any questions today during the live format, you can go ahead and pop those in the chat and then we'll get them answered as soon as possible.

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Karlie Libby: So today we're gonna be talking about how to confirm property taxes via the county tax assessor, so I'll hand it on over to Caeli to get us going.

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CAELI RIDGE: Thank you, Miss Carly. Guys, does Carly look any different? Is she? Does she look like she's shining at all she is now Miss Karlie Smith. She is since been married, I think, since you guys last saw her. So. Congratulations! I have really yet to get into it with her. It's she's been back for, II think, almost 3 weeks, and we have yet to really talk about it so. But you look you do look like you're just the the glowing bride, I can tell. Thank you so much. It was a magical day, and it's just so crazy to have a husband.

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CAELI RIDGE: I remember it's funny that you say that I remember that after I was married it was weird to say, this is my husband right? I felt kind of

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Karlie Libby: older somehow, anyway. Yes, definitely. Congratulations again. Thank you.

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CAELI RIDGE: Thank you, Miss Miss Kay. Guys, I missed you. Did anybody miss me?

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CAELI RIDGE: I feel like I was. I've been out of sorts. It it feel like I. You know, I was traveling a lot. Now we're back, and it's year end, and and things are always hectic during the holidays, especially for us, I think. But this kind of my normalcy, my, my Tuesdays with you guys we're missing. I felt it. So I'm happy to be back today's topic. I wanna start with a couple of other things first. But today's topic is courtesy of one of our our clients. So, Miss Janifer, if you happen to catch this after the fact.

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CAELI RIDGE: this is for you, my friend. We're in talk about property taxes and how to identify them and confirm them for yourselves. Via the county tax assessors. I'm gonna share screen here in a minute and give you guys an example of where to look and what to be looking for, and how some of it can be misinterpreted if you don't know what you're looking at, or for, really. So we'll get to that in a second. But before we start there. I have a question for you, and I've asked Carly to create a poll for us

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CAELI RIDGE: and for those that are gonna catch this after the fact, which is the vast majority of you if you want to. Just email info at Ridge lending group, whether you would have any need for the following, we would appreciate it. I think we'll try and do a poll in the community as well. I have been kicking around the idea of creating

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CAELI RIDGE: kind of a course, a syllabus, and and course, if you will, for my clients. kids for their prodigies, for teenagers, maybe from, I would think, 14 or 15 through their their early mid late 20 s. For those that that have children that have

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CAELI RIDGE: either communicated any desire to get into real estate, or you have your own ambitions to get them into real estate. I've had a few people bring this to my attention, and I know that that for me I wish that I had had something like that when I was

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CAELI RIDGE: younger. Ii have a unique situation with my kids, and being able to provide it to them, although if you were to ask either of them they're not quite at that stage that II have any real value, so I'd have to find a stranger to educate them about things that would be important. But so anybody that has or knows anyone that has kind of teenagers like, I said through their twenties. Maybe that would find value or use in

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CAELI RIDGE: a concentrated course. I'm thinking once or twice a week for 4 to 8 weeks. I really don't know. I'm just kind of putting this idea out there to see if there is a need. So Carly, could you throw that up there. And if you guys personally or know of anyone that you think would value from this if you wanted to answer yes or no. So again, a course on real estate financing literacy for our children, so that when they do become viable candidates for financing

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CAELI RIDGE: they have some information, right? They've they've been armed with some some information that can help them make informed decisions and and prepare them for getting qualified.

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CAELI RIDGE: Thank you, Ms. Carly. and if you don't have anybody. That's okay, too.

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CAELI RIDGE: Okay. So 2 for 2 answered, there's not a ton here, but again, for those of you that that are. Gonna watch this after shoot us an email, please info Richland group.com. If you think that you personally your kids or friends, or whatever would have any interest in

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CAELI RIDGE: your children attending with me personally, one on one

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CAELI RIDGE: finance Literacy, as it relates to real estate and mortgage investing mortgage needs and real estate investing. Thank you. Okay, that's that's that for that. Let me share my screen.

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CAELI RIDGE: And I don't know how long this is. Gonna take you guys. So I'm gonna kind of zip through this and obviously depending on QA. Afterwards we'll we'll say how long we spend on this. and let's get rid of that.

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CAELI RIDGE: and then, if we have time left over and everybody's interested, I thought I would take a few minutes and talk about the state of affairs and what is coming down the pike we've got.

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CAELI RIDGE: The pce results.

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CAELI RIDGE: Personal consumption, expenditure, results coming out on the thirtieth of this month, which, depending on how that reads I can expect, or we should expect to see, some potential improvement to interest rates. I'll explain that in a minute. Let me share my screen and let's talk about how to find and confirm property taxes when vetting for your roi and and checking properties out.

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CAELI RIDGE: where's my share? There it is.  Hold on, Gany. I'm smarter than I look, I swear.

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CAELI RIDGE: Where is it? There it is. Okay. Share.

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CAELI RIDGE: Okay, so let's get to. I can never see. How do I hide that?

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CAELI RIDGE: I don't know how to hide that thing, and then I can't see my

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CAELI RIDGE: alright. So I started. I chose Florida. It's it's a pretty common place to invest right now. We're seeing lots and lots of interest in Florida for a variety of reasons. But I just started there. II chose Walton County. So you've got to identify and actually let me back up. If you guys ever need a quick

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CAELI RIDGE: look at what the property taxes are. You can always email, us use info at Ridgeline group.com, you can email us the property address. We have access to kind of insider information. So we have access to property profiles via our title companies that we work with closely. It would be a cost to you guys, we can run these largely for free. So if you want to send us an email, we can produce a property profile

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CAELI RIDGE: that in addition to the property taxes, now, if it's new construction, it's it's not going to give us the the read on what the actual after completion taxes are going to be. But there's other data on there that might be useful. You're gonna have an Apn number on there. You're gonna figure out

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CAELI RIDGE: what the the title search was. Who are the prior owners? Even what the last mortgage related? Loans on the property were. So if you're trying to negotiate, for example, if you're trying to negotiate with a seller directly the price point on a property, you can kinda get a feel for what they might owe. It'll also contain, recent comp's like kind properties that have sold in the last 6 to 12 months on this property report. So there's some good information and some other tidbits and details there.

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CAELI RIDGE: So if you guys need something like that, I mean, we couldn't just do them at nauseam, you know, you know, dozens and dozens a month per individual. But if something comes up one or 2 or 3 a month that you guys need a property profile, just email, some address, and we'll provide that and and send you a copy. Okay. Otherwise, if you wanna do some of this on your own, and you're looking to identify where

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CAELI RIDGE: to confirm taxes. Let's say it's a turnkey scenario, and you wanna just confirm what the performer that the turnkey is is provided is accurate and true. The best place to do that is, gonna be with the county tax assessor

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CAELI RIDGE: now identifying the county is first and foremost, and then it may be called something else, as you can see here. County property appraiser is the the name of this one tax collector. So it it's gonna vary a little bit. You may have to do a little bit of digging.

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CAELI RIDGE: but in any case, what you'll do is you'll you'll figure out

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where you need to go.

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CAELI RIDGE: It'll lead you to. I thought I had this up in a different way.

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CAELI RIDGE: Did I not do that.

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CAELI RIDGE: I guess not. Okay. So the front page it it should be pretty clear, and it'll give you. Most of them are pretty easy. They're not, you know, there's not too deep of a rabbit hole that you need to go down on most of these websites. But you're gonna be looking for property taxes. Once you find that you're gonna enter in an address. Okay

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CAELI RIDGE: the one that I was using before. I'm just pulling

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CAELI RIDGE: an address out.

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CAELI RIDGE: This is actually a property that I used to own. And it's in Florida. So I just, I'm using this one. And this is public record. You guys, anybody can get to this. Okay? So when you find the property that you're looking at, let's go to details. I believe it was

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CAELI RIDGE: okay.

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CAELI RIDGE: So the information should be laid out here. Okay? And and you're gonna notice there's there's lots and lots of different numbers here, and this will be useful for new construction, and I'll come back to that in a second. But in this case it's not new construction. It's an existing dwelling, and you can get the breakdown of what the individual property taxes are tied to, because it's not just one number. Generally you're gonna have, you know, school there's there's other sorts of of

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CAELI RIDGE: state stamp taxes and different things that can be attached to and associated with the actual property. So if you and and one of the mistakes that most people make when they're trying to figure this out is they? They look for the millage rate. That's what these numbers are. Right here the millage rate. And normally they'll find the number added by itself. Because, like I said, the overall millage rate, if it's not, new construction is attached to the individual

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CAELI RIDGE: taxes that each of these different things in this particular county is collecting for. And, as you can see, there's a total down here. But if you'll notice these different numbers

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CAELI RIDGE: to the right of the numbers. The assessed value, which is what it's going to be based off of can change right. And I can't really explain why they change. I have no idea. I think there are different caps, and there will be something too, for home, for what's your face? The

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CAELI RIDGE: the exemption

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CAELI RIDGE: homeowner exemption if you live there, if it was your primary residence which won't apply to most of you. But in in any case it's not going to be super important just to know that they're different numbers. The millage rate percentage is based on individual numbers. In this case most of these are on the assessed value of the property, the school

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CAELI RIDGE: taxes that are associated with the property taxes.

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CAELI RIDGE: There's some random calf. I can't explain that in this case. But most importantly, what I want to do the math for on is, how are we getting to this final number? So for this particular property for this year, right? Making sure that you're looking at the appropriate year. The total was $7,226 and 15 cents.

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CAELI RIDGE: The sum of this is not as easy as taking. Forget for a second. Let's just assume that these numbers, that this 9 73 was the same as the rest of these in the assessed value. Just for a minute. You can't just take that number and multiply it by the sum of the millage rate. It doesn't work that way. You're gonna have to do each individual basis tax. And the multiplication

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CAELI RIDGE: is going to be. You're gonna take the decimal point and move it over one to the left because it's per 1,000 of the assessed value. So if you were to take this number

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CAELI RIDGE: times point 3 6 0%,

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CAELI RIDGE: that's how you're gonna get 2298, 88 cents.

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CAELI RIDGE: Okay. Now, it's gonna give you the amount, anyway. And the reason I'm going into all of this is because for newer construction, which is becoming more common, especially in Florida, the millage rate is the only way you're gonna be able to quantify what the end taxes are gonna be because this will not have been reported.

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CAELI RIDGE: Okay, I know this is a little bit convoluted, and when all else fails. If you just are not getting the data, you can't find it. It's not computing for you. All you gotta do is call the county. Usually you get them on the first try. They're they're individual counties in these areas.

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CAELI RIDGE: They're not overrun with, you know, volumes and volumes of phone calls. You'll usually be able to get somebody on the phone immediately, and you can give them an address, and they should be able to get you a number. So when all else fails. You can just pick the phone, call the county tax assessor's office boom. You should be good to go.

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CAELI RIDGE: Anybody have any questions about that pretty simple overall. So 2 options. Okay, you got your millage right here. You can figure out if you find the county tax assessors website, punch in an address, you should be able to find it. It should just give you a total, and that will be the confirmation.

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CAELI RIDGE: It's new construction. There's gonna be a millage rate per 1,000. You're gonna calculate it that way, or the maybe a simpler way. If you've got a one or 2 or 3 off per month or so. Just email, info ridgelending group.com, and we will produce or pull a property profile for you. That will, in in addition to the taxes. It's gonna have other useful information that you may need about the property. In fact, we can even

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CAELI RIDGE: get kind of fancy with it and give you all kinds of demographics about neighborhoods and and crime, and all kinds of cool stuff within that property profile which is

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CAELI RIDGE: public record. For the most part, you just have to know where to look for it.

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CAELI RIDGE: Okay. QA. Anybody have any questions about any of that?

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CAELI RIDGE: Jags? Got a question. Okay, how do we calculate assess values? So jag, that's exactly what you're going to do on new construction is you're going to take

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CAELI RIDGE: the millage rate, and you'll find that same thing. You got to go to the county. You have any issues finding the millage rate. This is the millage rate. Well, in this case this is the the total of the millage rate. But you're going to need to do it individually. Per the tax

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CAELI RIDGE: times.

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CAELI RIDGE: the purchase price, right? The sale price. And that's how you're going to figure out what the taxes are going to be or confirm what the taxes are going to be

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CAELI RIDGE: after construction is complete. It'll be via the millage rate

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CAELI RIDGE: times the the purchase price. And that's how you're going to get that. But again you're going to, if it if there's more, and very rarely are you going to have property taxes in any county? There's just one number.

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CAELI RIDGE: It's going to be a collective of all of these different

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CAELI RIDGE: different criteria. So do them individually. and it should be broken out just like this so that you can. You can get that final number?

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CAELI RIDGE: Jack asked, so we will assume that the sale price is the assess price across the lot. Yes, that should be the case. Yes, take the sales price on new construction. And that's how the the county tax assessor is going to be from the sale. That's the number that's going to be used initially to calculate the the taxes.

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CAELI RIDGE: That won't always be the case. going forward right as they're reassessed annually, or every couple of years, or whatever. But yeah.

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Karlie Libby: she asked. Would this also be the case for rehabs?

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CAELI RIDGE: No, it shouldn't. You should be able to. Just yeah. It should be just through sale. I can't think of an instance where?

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CAELI RIDGE: No, unless it's it's trading unless it's changing ownership. It should not rehab should remain the same, and you should be able to pull that online. You know, you guys can get for existing properties, too. I easy enough to to get a quick baseline from from Zillow or Red Finn, or whatever they. In some cases, if you want the exact real time valid number, you want to go to the county, the county tax assessors site, and you should be able to pull it off there.

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CAELI RIDGE: Okay.

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CAELI RIDGE: alright before. We move on to kind of pop in mind stuff and and the market conditions interest rates, everybody's favorite topic. Is there anything that you guys have for me that has come up?

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CAELI RIDGE:  personally, relatively, anything that anybody's got questions about scenarios, product questions, anything like that?

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Monte Myers: Oh, hi, Kaylee, this is Monty. I have a question.

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Monte Myers: Hi, Monty! Hi! I recently bought a property mid year, and I was wondering if you could kind of do an overview of like, how they calculate the Supplemental Bill and how that all works.

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Monte Myers: Are we talking about the taxes? Yeah, the property taxes.

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CAELI RIDGE: I'll try. Give me the scenario, Monty.

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Monte Myers: So I bought a 4 flex in let's say, September thirtieth. So II haven't looked at my closing statement since I signed it, but I know there was something with property taxes on that.

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Monte Myers: and since I bought it essentially cash, I'm just coming up on my first payment December tenth in my county.

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Monte Myers: and I it's still got the old property owners loaded onto the website of the county. And so I, you know, if I don't have to pay the whole amount

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Monte Myers: without going down to the county. I don't want to.

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CAELI RIDGE: Okay? So yeah, I think I think I can address this one. So first of all, a lot of times the county it it. There's going to be a delay between

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CAELI RIDGE: what shows up on the consumer side when you're doing a a search for the owner, the owner of record there. It's not going to be instantaneous. So the day that you close, or the next day or the next week, it's not automatically going to show you as the new owner. But it is in the system, and the timestamp of the date that you took possession of the property will be obvious and and relevant. Now I'd have to take a look at the closing disclosure to tell you for sure.

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But what I can say is is that from the date. And this is all gonna be relative to the individual county. And what that tax property tax year says, and and most of them are gonna vary pretty wildly.

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CAELI RIDGE: So depending on those variables. Okay? And if you want to, Monty, send me the address, and I see I'll see if I can, I can get you more exacting information. But from the date that you took possession, possession, right, the date that you closed on that property, you became officially the owner. You are now responsible from that moment until the end of that property tax year.

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CAELI RIDGE: and within the statements that you're gonna be getting well first of all.

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CAELI RIDGE: within your closing statement. Even though you didn't have a loan, you're going to have probably paid from that moment until the end of that tax year. So you'll start getting statements from the county that you know taxes are due, and and they may be due quarterly semi annually annually, but you'll be getting notification from them when they become due. And what those amounts are. And a lot of times, guys, you'll have an option.

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CAELI RIDGE: You may have a small discount. You may receive a small discount on the annual property taxes if you pay them all in full versus breaking them up into quarterly, you know, or semi-annual payments.

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CAELI RIDGE: so there may be some incentive to do it that way. If you've got the the extra proceeds to do that. But if, Monty, tell me if I'm not answering your question, they're going to have a record of what you are responsible for, chances. Are you paid for what that was at closing, and then they'll become due again whenever that that county

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CAELI RIDGE: year or that tax year is is relevant.

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Monte Myers: Yeah, that was as much as can be expected for you to know about my situation, I suppose. I just need to get out my closing statement and see what was on there, and then.

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Monte Myers: God forbid! Go down to the county and walk in wait in the line. You won't have to. Just if you want to send me the closing disclosure. I can kind of help you, and then I can pull up on my end what the tax year looks like

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CAELI RIDGE: and and give you an idea. Otherwise we certainly do not have to march down there. A phone call would get it done. If if we can't figure it out on our own.

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Karlie Libby: Okay, thank you. I've got. I've got your address here, Monty. I'm gonna send you an email with Jaylee attached there. Afterwards. You guys can talk about that more if you need to, of course. Alright, Ron Beth, you had your hand up first, so why don't you go ahead.

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Ron Betts: hey? Yeah, thank you for taking my question. So and one of the questions I have it may seem simple, but tax statements just came out. I'm in Albuquerque, New Mexico, and the question I have is

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Ron Betts: disputing the tax rates? Can you speak a little bit about that? I know, as the rates go, the rates go up as the property appreciates, and I don't really know a reason why, for investment, I would want to dispute that. But could you speak a little bit about that, Jaylee? Please? Yeah, no problem, Ron. And and there's there's no small, too small to big question guys. Truly. That's what I'm here for is to answer best I can. You know there used to be a thing where and this is years and years ago, where?

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CAELI RIDGE: It was kind of a loophole. Investors could write letters, and and they I don't remember that being hardship letters. But there was a certain formula that you could use to get with the county to see if you were eligible for a reduction in what your property taxes were, and it was kind of a little hack that you could use to save a little bit and and potentially increase your cash from the property.

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CAELI RIDGE: A lot of it is gonna have to do with homeowners exemption. And I'm saying that wrong, it's another term, and I'm totally spacing on it. In any case.

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CAELI RIDGE: I think that it's just as easy as saying, write a letter to the county and and dispute and say I need a break on taxes. I'm not able to afford the property taxes in this area. What are my options? It's not gonna change from one individual to the next. So if there is something that is of consideration within that county. They have to give you exactly what what needs to be requested, or the portal in which you have to put the request in, etc.

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CAELI RIDGE: So it's a kind of I think it's a No. Ask them. No, get them. I do not believe that it's going to be dependent upon

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CAELI RIDGE: unless you're a homeowner. In which case that's a different conversation. But for investors.

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CAELI RIDGE: I think it's just an ask. And and what are the pro. What are the what is the process to request a reduction in property taxes? Or is there a way I can dispute the the assessed value that's used to calculate these property taxes, and it should be pretty straightforward, clear cut, and and

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CAELI RIDGE: see if it's a possibility. Is that helpful?

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Ron Betts: Would you recommend that, or just ride with it, since it means that the property is going up in value.

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CAELI RIDGE: No, III absolutely, I would request doing. If you can save a little bit in the taxes, for sure. The tax assessed value has nothing to do with the fair market value that that you and I care about for appraisal and and harvesting equity, or or selling, or that kind of thing? But for tax purposes exclusively. That tax assessed value is very, very different, and one doesn't isn't necessarily going to bleed into the other.

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CAELI RIDGE: Yeah, thank you. Good question, Ron. Thank you.

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Karlie Libby: Perfect. And I think, jag you had your hand up next, so why don't you go ahead?

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Jag C: Yes, thank you. Hi, Joey, thank you for doing this. Hi, Jack!

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Jag C: So I had a couple of questions, actually. Oh, 1 one

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Jag C: statement. When I bought a property in Cleveland it was a turnkey. I bought it off a performer. and the tax on that was

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Jag C: meant to be around 5.5,000

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Jag C: when we got into the tax here, cause I closed in November, so the next

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Jag C: I got a bill for $15,000.

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Jag C: Talk about this was that was that you? I feel like, yes, that was me. So I'm just curious how that could have even happened that the mortgage company couldn't pick up on that the

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Jag C: the the turnkey company that did the pro forma didn't, and of course, I was a complete green

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Jag C: green investor completely at that stage. So just just to pass horrible story on for what it's worth.

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CAELI RIDGE: That is horrible, right. I mean, that takes what you're you're performing what you were expecting on this property, and and

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Jag C: not a small small amount. It sounds like I'd need to do a little bit more investigative work with you on this, Jack, but it sounds like there might have been delinquent taxes, and that doesn't make sense, either, because, you know, taxes take first lean position, delinquent taxes. So you tell it. Let me just make sure. Understand. So 5,000 is what it was. It was slated at.

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Jag C: and even at the time that you closed it it was 5,000 and everything. Yes.

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Jag C: and then that went up by. Just a few months later the value

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Jag C: and the only reason we were able to get away with it was because the turnkey company hadn't done the rehab.

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Jag C: so we were able to show that there was vacancies and we weren't. You know, we didn't have the income to support a 15 K

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Jag C: in the 15 K tax on the property, and that the valuation was all wrong, like I paid for a turnkey property which I didn't get.

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Jag C: It wasn't performing, so they let me have it.

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Jag C: Right? So they were like, Okay, we get it. But it's interesting that the school district was saying that you paid X amount. So therefore your tax should be 15. K,

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CAELI RIDGE: well, okay, so okay, that, okay, that makes more sense. Then so in that case, guys, what what's happening here is that the taxes of the property as they exist right now are based on

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CAELI RIDGE: the value. Well, the value as it's gone up from the time that it was purchased, but it started at that purchase price right? And taxes are going to continue to accre increase based on a you know, a certain margin. But from that time until jag you bought it. If we go back and look at the transaction history, that initial acquisition price to when you bought it, I bet was a huge margin. Correct.

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Jag C: all right. But you know, cheerlead, what happened is even in the pro forma that took into account the new price.

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Jag C: The taxes weren't shown to go up that much cause. If they had gone up to the 15 K. Nobody would have touched the property right? Right? So the turnkey obviously dropped the ball, but it's and Escrow wouldn't have caught yet, cause it wasn't reassessed. No, but no, but nobody thought about checking like I guess Escrow didn't check that.

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Jag C: The property tax calculations were correct, and the mortgage company didn't check it, either, because they'd be a screwing for it. So the Dsecr. Or you'd look at, you know. Could could the property actually pay the taxes right? Can the render

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CAELI RIDGE: what I think I'm hearing then, unless I'm misunderstanding another detail? Is that the turnkey did not account cause escrow is going to give you what the taxes are now

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CAELI RIDGE: okay, as as they exist today, going forward with the the new. It's got a new value. The property was now sold at a million dollars, and but the first time it was sold it was half a million dollars whatever whatever it was. The performance is based on today, and the the county has reassessed, based on the new value. That would not have come up there. It should have been the turnkey's responsibility to have. So what the lawyers said. He said

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Jag C: that, in fact.

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Jag C: that the

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Jag C: that based on the new value. The school district had calculated the right percentages.

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Jag C: and, in fact, what they were looking for was correct, except

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Jag C: that

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Jag C: because the value was not justified since the rehab was now complete. We didn't have to pay it that year.

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CAELI RIDGE: Thank God! What about going forward? Is it? Is it? Is it capped at that or capped at that level as it goes up incrementally. So I think that no, I think that at some stage they'll go back to it once the once the property starts performing. I don't know. I sold it

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CAELI RIDGE: now.

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CAELI RIDGE: Well, so that that's just another example of of that due diligence right, especially if you're just getting into real estate investing. Yeah.

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Jag C: But I had a question for you on that as well. So I invest in Florida as well, and I heard I read somewhere recently. I don't know if it's something that you are aware of, that. If you transfer a property into an Llc.

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Jag C: You're liable to be hit with a higher tax rate. It's a recent change in rules. And II was just trying to get a sense of. If that is really correct cause, I assume it would impact a lot of investors.

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Jag C: So are we talk, yeah, are we talking about the transfer tax? Or we talking about actual property tax.

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Jag C: I have not heard this. Okay.

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CAELI RIDGE: doesn't mean that normally something like that would have crossed my desk. I have not heard that. Now I can tell you that, you know, depending on the county transferring from an individual name into an Llc. Or vice versa, can trigger a transfer tax like a one time cost to do that. But it's not to the the property taxes. That's not something I'm familiar with. If you find it again.

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CAELI RIDGE: Jagger, or if it was a a publication or an article or something, send it my way. I'll start checking with our our escrow and title companies down there that we work with regularly and see what they have to say.

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Jag C: Thank you. Yeah, you bet.

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CAELI RIDGE: But speaking of that, transfer taxes different than property taxes.

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CAELI RIDGE: It's a good little segue or mentioned for those that are interested in that.

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CAELI RIDGE: asset protection, and you want your properties in your Llc. However, the financing, the leverage that you're securing has to be in your individual name and title has to close in your individual name. You are well within your rights to transfer the title ownership into the Llc. Fannie. Freddy rules say, as long as you hold majority ownership of the Llc. That's perfectly fine. No due on sale clause is going to come up.

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CAELI RIDGE: but make sure that you check with that particular county before you get too far down that road because those transfer taxes in some counties can be outrageous. Pennsylvania, as a result, is notorious for this. Give me thousands and thousands of dollars depending on the loan amount where it's a simple pass through right? It's your name.

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CAELI RIDGE: I changed it from Chile Ridges name, and I'm putting it in to my Llc name. I'm a hundred percent owner. So it is me right? There's there's no

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CAELI RIDGE: no difference, no no collusion. There.

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CAELI RIDGE: hold on, guys, I don't know if you can hear that, but let's just hang up at one if I hadn't done my due diligence, but I really needed that property in the Llc. For my asset, protection for my peace of mind. Doing so could charge me 5 grand.

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CAELI RIDGE: So just from that perspective, too

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CAELI RIDGE: different than property taxes, which is what we've been talking about here today. Transfer taxes from simply an individual name into a single member. Llc. Or whatever it is, can be expensive in certain counties. Not all but certain counties do impose some pretty harsh transfer taxes. So check that out if you're intending on. If you're closing in your name and intending and putting it into an Llc. After the fact.

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CAELI RIDGE: Yes, homestead who gave me that one? Ron? Good. Thank you exactly. Homestead exemption? Yes, that's what it is.

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Karlie Libby: Oh, there's my article from Jack Karl. You save that for me. Yeah, absolutely. So yeah. The the question Ron had about home, State exemption.

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Karlie Libby: he's asking what might constitute a modification or change to the amount of increase on either a single family residence or multi-family rental property. He received all his property tax statements, and they've increased quite a bit.

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Karlie Libby: He's wondering if it makes sense to rebuttal or disagree with the increases, especially

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as they haven't increased rents, particularly on county assisted residents.

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Karlie Libby: So that is the homestead.

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CAELI RIDGE: Well, that's I mean, the Homestead exemption is, is, I think, he was just answering my question, that's for yeah. Yeah. I I'm gonna go back to Ron Betts. Qa. No. Ask him. No. Get him in. Yeah, if you have the time. Heck, yeah, ask. See if you can get some kind of a discount on there.

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CAELI RIDGE: a.

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CAELI RIDGE: Is it possible? Maybe, but if you don't ask, you're never gonna know for sure, and by how much I don't know how much you you we can expect. That the the decrease might be. But I think the first part of your question. Let me just look at that here.

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CAELI RIDGE: What might constitute modification, or change the amount or increase. It's annual. I don't know a county that is not increasing, at least every other year, those property taxes. And it's I think it's inflationary based

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CAELI RIDGE: cost of living goes up. The property taxes are gonna go up. I know that. II don't know that I've ever had a property where those property taxes remained

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Ron Merchlewitz: static for any length of time. So, and the question with, or the answer with Ron Bett, sir, that was absolutely perfect at about nailed what I was talking about.

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Ron Merchlewitz: But question, I have also. Who do you recommend? I go to with the city to, or the county to

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Ron Merchlewitz: rebuttal. That is there a certain department or A name that of a department that you recommend?

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CAELI RIDGE: Just go straight to the county tax assessor's office. You know it. It may be called property tax assessor.

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CAELI RIDGE: You're gonna find it. And if you get stuck, just email me the county, and then I'll do a quick search

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CAELI RIDGE: and then I'll forward. You guys a link it should not be hard to find. So whatever the county is type in that name, and then property tax assessor

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and

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CAELI RIDGE: 99. It's gonna come up and then just find out the contact information.

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CAELI RIDGE: Call there first and say, who do I talk to about disputing this property's taxes?

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Ron Merchlewitz: Excellent, thank you.

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CAELI RIDGE: What else? Gang anybody have anything else?

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CAELI RIDGE: No, okay. Let's then finish with the state of affairs.

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CAELI RIDGE: So

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CAELI RIDGE: the the personal consumption expenditures index. Pce. E is what it's called there's also something called Cpi consumer price index. They? Relatively, I'm not gonna get into the the minutia of that. They they relatively produce the same information overall. There are some slight differences in terms of its measure and and what it's really looking at, and some of them take energy and food out, and housing can come out. There's core, pce, etc. Etc.

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CAELI RIDGE: But the basics here are going to be that the the fed Reserve.

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CAELI RIDGE: Okay, they focus on both. But primarily they're gonna be looking at the P. The pce. This is gonna be published on the thirtieth of this month. So in a couple of days we're gonna get those numbers.

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CAELI RIDGE: I expect that they're going to be on on the downturn. That will be good news if I'm correct, for where long term rates are are headed, or at least in the short term where they're gonna go now, let me quantify by saying

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CAELI RIDGE: if I'm right and pce comes it underperforms. It comes in lower than some expectations, and long term rates as a result of that, are affected to the positive to our benefit.

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CAELI RIDGE: I want to set the right expectation. That doesn't mean that you guys are, gonna see? Massive reductions in in interest rate. Probably more than anything. If you guys have anybody here or anybody listening has gotten a rate quote on an investment property in the last year. You've noticed that there are extra points associated with whatever rate you're you're being quoted right?

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CAELI RIDGE: You've got the lenders compensation. And then there's extra points. It's a function of premium pricing. And in a high rate environment. There is no premium pricing because the services are going to be taking a loss. They know that we're going to be refinancing these loans prior to profitability of the servicing right of these loans, so their charge, their extra points, are a function of that and covering for those losses. Okay?

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CAELI RIDGE: So if the Pce comes in, the report comes in lower, and we do see improvement to interest rate. I don't know that it's necessarily going to be a direct correlation of the rate itself rather than the points associated. I think we're more likely to see similar rates, maybe an eighth of a point improvement. I don't know. Well, I mean, we're gonna know in a few days.

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CAELI RIDGE: But if rate, the rate for all intents and purposes was 7 and a half percent, and it was at a cost of 3 points. Perhaps it's still 7 and a half percent, but maybe it's at a cost of 2 points.

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CAELI RIDGE: 2, 2 and a quarter points whatever it is so. My expectation for the the next few days and getting that report and how it's gonna translate for us is, chances are it'll be more about the points that we're gonna be quoted and and having to pay versus necessarily a significant reduction in rate. If we do see an actual reduction in rate, I would anticipate it to be a smallish number.

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CAELI RIDGE: I guess, unless it it falls off the cliff unless the PC. Comes in way below anybody's expectation, in which case II guess anything's possible. Maybe we see a quarter 3 8

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CAELI RIDGE: highly highly improbable to see anything beyond that. But remember, I can't help but but remind everybody when we're talking about interest rate.

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CAELI RIDGE: Extremely important to do that math, and largely dictated by the loan size. Most of us. Most of our clients are operating in the space where the loan amount might be $100,000 up to $200,000 in that kind of range, and in which case an eighth or a quarter of a percentage point, you guys is 6 bucks a month, 9 bucks a month.

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CAELI RIDGE: Please try to to keep that in mind. I wrote in in our last. I think it was our last newsletter. Ii think I was having a moment, and I kinda went off on you know, interest rates and and shoppers and etc. And while I understand as investors, we certainly want to get the best deal that we can.

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CAELI RIDGE: I think people put way too much priority on the actual interest rate, and they're missing out on opportunities that would otherwise be there, cause they're not. They're they're doing it psychologically. They're not doing it logically and and with the math, anyway. Alright, I'll shut up about that? What questions do you guys have on any of those topics rates, or or

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CAELI RIDGE: pce? If I could answer it, or or anything like that or anything else. There's my Buddy Ron, go, ron.

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Ron Merchlewitz: It seemed like the the market.

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Ron Merchlewitz: the the fed is based, the rates off the market. How does the the banks and the lenders base their points? Will it be 2 points or 3 points? What? How? Who determines what the bank charges as spread?

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CAELI RIDGE: So okay, so what I'll do is I'm gonna try and backtrack and and start from the beginning.

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CAELI RIDGE: When we're talking about mortgage backed securities. Okay, as a lender. First of all, Ridge is a direct lender. In that we fund on our warehouse lines we underwrite in house. We do not service these loans. So by a servicing of the loan, that is, who you actually are writing your check to, and who you send off your mortgage payment to. That is your servicer. A servicer is going to purchase in bulk mortgage back securities from a lender.

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CAELI RIDGE: Okay, we. They are resold in the secondary market, and they will pay a premium

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CAELI RIDGE: for the rights to service those mortgage-backed securities. The premium is typically 1% of the sum of the bundle of mortgage backed securities that they have purchased, and we know that within timeline for servicers to be profitable, it's about 36 months from the day that they purchase until they start in the black, they start to realize profits from that upfront cost.

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CAELI RIDGE: So

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CAELI RIDGE: as a result of that, and and knowing that in a high rate environment that we have been in for the last 18 months, or whatever we know that interest rates. They don't stay up when they go up. They don't stay up when they go down. They don't stay down, so we are on the downhill slant, I believe, and most people would agree with that. So as a result, what happens when interest rates start to fall? People are gonna start refinancing those loans that the servicer just paid a premium to

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CAELI RIDGE: service. If that loan refinances. It pays off. The servicer has just lost

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CAELI RIDGE: right? They're they're in the red. Okay? So they have to hedge. So I think that the the answer to your question is, it's going to depend on some of the the reporting and the data. It's always on a lag

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CAELI RIDGE: but

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CAELI RIDGE: the margin for which those points are going to be

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CAELI RIDGE: charged is going to be a direct indication of what the secondary markets are seeing for the short term, and the long-term, and where they think rates are, and how quickly or how slowly they're going to meet

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CAELI RIDGE: that that baseline. The Feds have been very, very clear that they want inflation at 2%. Which, by the way, I'm having a hard time getting anyone to answer me? On? Why is that the number. Why is that the benchmark? I know it has been for a long time. But where did that come from? Why does it have to stay there? Why can't it be 2.2? Why can't it be 2.5, whatever it is?

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CAELI RIDGE: But they have been very, very clear that that is what they're after, and they're not gonna stop until they get there. So they're gonna take their formulas, Wall Street and secondary markets, etc., and take their formulas and based on the pce that's coming out based on the the reports or the employment or the jobs report and things. All of that data is gonna be collectively combined. And they're going to see from here. I'm sure they've got models and and crazy algorithms that they're gonna use.

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CAELI RIDGE: Let's say, this is where we're at right here. This is where we were a year ago. This is where inflation was. It was 9. Whatever back in in March it's at 3. Was it? 3? Now?

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CAELI RIDGE: Here are the readings from the jobs report. Here's where Pce came in this month. They're gonna take all of that. And then they're gonna try and forecast from now and see, when are we gonna get down to rates of X?

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CAELI RIDGE: How long is that spread between here and here, and I think that's going to dictate, Ron.

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Ron Merchlewitz: What the ultimate result for you and paying points is going to be. That was a very ugly, convoluted way to explain that. But that's the best way I know. How did any of it make sense? Did you track any of those sharp? Thank you that at least

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Ron Merchlewitz: I know enough to be dangerous, and that that help that helped me understand it better. That's perfect. Thank you

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CAELI RIDGE: a little. There's a little bit. There's little pieces in there. I think, that that come across

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CAELI RIDGE: digestible enough. And and please understand.

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CAELI RIDGE: You said that you're you know enough to be dangerous. I'm in that boat, man. II certainly I know II cause I get to see it and and hear it, and I'm in that space more than than you guys are. But trust me, II don't know enough to be able to speak as articulately as the guys I'm listening to over here are trying to talk to me about it. And when they start talking I'm like, Okay, slow down.

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CAELI RIDGE: I I'm I'm not tracking 3 quarters of that, anyway. So there you go.

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CAELI RIDGE: you bet. Ron.

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CAELI RIDGE: Okay, guys, Carly, what do we have on tap? What's next? Let's kinda let's hook them. Let's tell them what we got coming.

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Karlie Libby: Yeah. So you guys are gonna be getting an email soon for December. And what dates we're gonna have for December are gonna be the twelfth which is, gonna be alive. And then the 20 sixth, which is gonna be pre recorded because it's right after Christmas. We're not expecting a lot of people to be there, or you know, people are, gonna be busy but let's see our

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Karlie Libby: topics. We're gonna have a guest speaker

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Karlie Libby: on 1212. That's the live, and that's gonna be Brent Widman. So keep an eye out for that. That's gonna be a really good one. Him and Shayla are gonna talk about how to round out 2023 and hit 2024 with purpose, as it pertains to financial stability, planning, preparation, action and consistency to help you guys reach your goals and and then on the 20 sixth

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Karlie Libby: for a pre-recorded topic, we're going to be talking about understanding and the risk management involved in non owner occupied financing. So keep a lookout for both of those those are coming down the pipeline. Thank you. Ms, Carly. Okay, guys, as always, we're here on standby. Is there any? Is there another question?

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Jag C: Yeah, I'm so sorry I have one more. That's okay. Jag. No, no, that's why I'm here. I was just wondering is, I know you had taken the all in one off for a bit. Is it available again.

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CAELI RIDGE: It is, it's back on. It was a short lived recoil.

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CAELI RIDGE: It's just I just love that download so much and as much as I'd like to tell the investor that we sell this to which makes our lives a lot of times living hell, our clients included. I'd like to tell them to go pound sand. I just can't do it because I really am such a fan of the product itself for the right individual. So yes, we've had that back. I apologize. Jag, if he didn't get that announcement or notification. It's been a couple of months now. So so the question also was, I know that recently we had talked about a second lean.

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Jag C: Maybe I misunderstood a second lane. He lock. Would that be right?

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Jag C: That is something quite different from the all in one, though

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CAELI RIDGE: it's very different. This is a secondly, Heloc it is in second lean position. Obviously it does not have any banking features attached to it. It's 5 years with a 25 year repay. Yeah, very, very different product. But and the the leverage is going to be a little bit less aggressive. So 60 combined loan to value. That's a Cltv on the II will reach out to you privately. In that case. Okay, Jack, you bet

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CAELI RIDGE: we do have one more here. Do you do loans for storage units? Yes, sir. Yes, ma'am, I don't know who's asking, but yes, we have commercial products that will allow for storage units. Commercial buildings. Strip mall mixed. Use apartments. Yes, absolutely. Let us know what your scenario is, and and we'll get you a quote.

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CAELI RIDGE: Okay, guys, I'm out happy holidays to all of you. I will be seeing you soon if you need us. Ridgeline group.com info ridgeline group.com 855 74 Ridge. My email is C. Ridge at Ridgeline group.com. We're here on standby as always.

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CAELI RIDGE: Thank you very much. See ya.